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Author Topic: Electronic Tuners  (Read 6146 times)

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Offline Nox

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Electronic Tuners
« on: Nov 18, 2004, 08:08:38 PM »
My old electronic tuner isn't working right anymore (but it's given me some 20 years - so no complaints)...my daughter has a really cool tuner for her oboe that I never get to borrow because I either can't find it...or she left it at school...

...so yesterday at the music store I bought an 'IntelliTouch Tuner - Barebone' tuner...seems very handy (and it's small enough to fit in my case...unlike my old one - BIG)...anyone else use one?  Or any comments on other makes and models?


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Offline Lllizard

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #1 on: Nov 18, 2004, 08:41:52 PM »
I use one all the time with a wire that clips to my bridge.  But I can't say what brand it is because I don't remember and the darn thing has gone missing:  it got passed around to far in orchestra I think.  I use one because when I tune to the piano my ear is strongly influenced by wishful thinking or how badly I don't feel like turning those pegs, especially if the A is really close anyway.  I need that red light to tell me to quit being lazy.

Offline corien

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #2 on: Nov 18, 2004, 09:26:03 PM »
Could it be this one?



I have one of these and it works fine.

Offline bassfiddler

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #3 on: Nov 19, 2004, 03:57:03 PM »
I use a Korg CA-30. Twenty bucks, works great. I also use a Pocket Tones tone generator, like an electronic pitchpipe, or sometimes, just a tuning fork A=440.

Offline marcb

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #4 on: Nov 19, 2004, 04:40:49 PM »
I use a Korg AT120
has a nice big screen with a fast and accurate needle
when playing together with instruments that are very difficult or almost impossible to tune (e.g. accordion) you can take over the tuning of that instrument and tune yours accordingly with the 0-point still being your new 0-point : you tune as if your A would be 440hz (the needle pointing at zero) although it may be from 380 to 480 hz.

I bought it second hand, thus rather cheap.

Marc B

Offline chuck1

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #5 on: Nov 19, 2004, 05:13:07 PM »
 ::)  Yup I have the barebones.  It is great when other instruments are tuning up too!  The only problem I have is that being so new to the instrument I needed a tuner that would tell if I was on the correct finger position.  The intelitouch is not well suited while you are playing --it falls off the instrument.....great for tuning with other instruments close by.

I also have a Korg CA-30 that I use when I want to see if I am at the right finger position.  Now the Korg is very sensitive--the slighest noise registers.  It does all the tuning that I need and it fits nicely in the case.  My shoulder rest doesnt so I dont you it much.  I am glad my tuner does...so does everyone else....chuck

Offline Richard

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #6 on: Nov 19, 2004, 08:24:35 PM »
I second the Korg CA-30. I use that on a link out from my DI box or second oputput on FX pedal.

I have used it with microphone though not a practical proposition without wiring up if a guitarist won't shut up when you are tuning.

Not tried the barebones myself yet. I have tried a number of "guitar" tuners and they mostly suck for violin apart from Korg. The Korg tuners seem to lock onto the note very quickly and give a good picture of tuning. I wouldnt mind a big Korg rackmount tuner but its a bit of overkill  for what I need.
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Offline Jackson

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #7 on: Nov 19, 2004, 10:00:35 PM »
I picked up a couple of Korg CA-30 tuners and Korg clip mics on ebay. The tuners were about $15 each, and mics $10 each. I don't use the clip mic when I'm tuning at home, but it's useful at sessions, where I can tune while the others are playing.
They work great for me.
Harry

Offline kesh

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #8 on: Nov 19, 2004, 11:06:47 PM »
I ues an intelli these days for all the reasons mentioned above.  I find that the position of the clamp varies from one fiddle to the next for getting a good response, so some experimentation is needed with positioning.

Offline Lllizard

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #9 on: Nov 20, 2004, 12:42:48 AM »
the Korg CA-30 is what I have too - still lost.  >:(

You can recallibrate it, which is good since the church piano is tuned to 442.  The clip attachment is great during rehersals when everyone else is warming up.  I used to use a tuning fork and press my ear against the violin to hear my note when other people were playing.  I gave up on that after I was at a weekend conferance with about 50 violins tuning at once.

Offline Steve_W

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #10 on: Nov 20, 2004, 07:01:03 PM »
But Llizard, if you're playing with other fiddles shouldn't you be tuning to THEM, not your tuning fork?  :)

I'm interested in these comments since for years I've used an old Seiko Tolv, made I think in the mid-80s, that was a hand-me-down from a relative.  It's a great tuner; analog needle and very accurate, but it's huge in comparison to modern tuners (won't quite fit in any of my accessory pockets) and it requires you to set the note manually.  Think I'll check out the Korg.  One question, though; can any of the electronic tuners be set to just intonation rather than equal temperament? -Steve W.

Offline Steve_W

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #11 on: Feb 03, 2005, 03:54:10 PM »
Aha, I've finally found an answer to my temperament question, which apparently killed this thread!  The Korg OT-12 tuner provides support for multiple temperaments, including Pythagorean which I think is equivalent to just intonation. http://www.korg.com/gear/info.asp?a_prod_no=OT12&category_id=5.  Fairly expensive, at around $90 street price (without the clip-on contact mic), and probably overkill for fiddling, but it should provide extremely accurate tuning! -Steve

Offline Richard Martin

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #12 on: Feb 03, 2005, 04:33:00 PM »
got a ca30 Korg also - still use my pitch pipes more often than not though ????

Offline fiddlegirlLA

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #13 on: Dec 07, 2005, 07:53:31 PM »
Aha, I've finally found an answer to my temperament question, which apparently killed this thread!  The Korg OT-12 tuner provides support for multiple temperaments, including Pythagorean which I think is equivalent to just intonation. http://www.korg.com/gear/info.asp?a_prod_no=OT12&category_id=5.  Fairly expensive, at around $90 street price (without the clip-on contact mic), and probably overkill for fiddling, but it should provide extremely accurate tuning! -Steve


Hi Steve,

I know you posted this a long time ago, but I just saw your post and have been looking for a "just" tuner as well - wondered if you like using the OT-12 and if it makes a difference over a chromatic tuner?

Thanks,
Andrea

Offline madmat

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #14 on: Dec 07, 2005, 08:32:36 PM »
The Korg OT-12 tuner provides support for multiple temperaments, including Pythagorean which I think is equivalent to just intonation.
If it supports "unjust" intonation, or "cruel and unusual" intonation, I think we'll get along fine! ;)
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Offline Steve_W

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #15 on: Dec 07, 2005, 09:02:50 PM »
Aha, I've finally found an answer to my temperament question, which apparently killed this thread!  The Korg OT-12 tuner provides support for multiple temperaments, including Pythagorean which I think is equivalent to just intonation. http://www.korg.com/gear/info.asp?a_prod_no=OT12&category_id=5.  Fairly expensive, at around $90 street price (without the clip-on contact mic), and probably overkill for fiddling, but it should provide extremely accurate tuning! -Steve


Hi Steve,

I know you posted this a long time ago, but I just saw your post and have been looking for a "just" tuner as well - wondered if you like using the OT-12 and if it makes a difference over a chromatic tuner?

Thanks,
Andrea

Actually I've been making do with my old Seiko but recently decided I need something more compact so will probably be shopping in the near future.  My feeling is that for most uses a tuner with equal intonation is probably adequate (and as I usually play with pianos or other keyboard instruments it's probably more appropriate) so I'll probably end up going with a CA-30 instead of paying the extra for the OT-12.  -Steve

Offline fiddlegirlLA

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #16 on: Dec 07, 2005, 09:23:02 PM »
I've been trying to decide between those two models as well. Anyone else out there that's tried the Korg OT-12 or another "just" tuner?

Andrea

Offline beeswing

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #17 on: Dec 07, 2005, 09:40:14 PM »
this handy gadget

Sorry, but it works for me, and doesn't cost a week's groceries.
I want to be a musician when I grow up.
Sorry, son, you can't do both.

Offline woodwiz

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #18 on: Dec 07, 2005, 09:58:57 PM »
this handy gadget

Sorry, but it works for me, and doesn't cost a week's groceries.

I've got tone of those, but it's so old it rings at 432 Hz.   doesn't matter, because I'm too deaf to hear it anyway.

I've got an old Seiko analog tuner that I keep at home, plugged in because it eats 9V batteres.  I keep a cheapo Quik Tune tuner in my case with a contact mike.  It's got a "pitch pipe" function, too for those times when a peg slips. And then there's the Tuner_E software that will tell you the exact frequency you are playing.

Offline sreizes

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #19 on: Dec 07, 2005, 10:01:10 PM »
this handy gadget
Next time my pitch pipe (A=435??) dies, I plan to get me one of those thingies.

it appears I was not paying proper attention to what I was doing with the quotes

;D
« Last Edit: Dec 07, 2005, 10:59:52 PM by sreizes »

Offline fiddlegirlLA

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #20 on: Dec 07, 2005, 10:18:20 PM »
I usually just tune by ear at home, but my problem is that I need a digital tuner on stage - that's why I'm considering splurging on the OT-12...on stage I can't hear myself tune w/ drums banging and the guitar player getting warmed up and 100 noisey things going on so I need to tune digitally - but even with a chromatic tuner I still need to adjust the tuning by ear after I use the tuner. Any one else with similar issues have a solution?  ;)

Andrea

Offline beeswing

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #21 on: Dec 07, 2005, 10:26:58 PM »
woodwiz: "I've got one of those, but it's so old it rings at 432 Hz. "

One word for you, young feller: Brasso.

Then check it with one of them newfangled quartz jobbies.
I want to be a musician when I grow up.
Sorry, son, you can't do both.

Offline woodwiz

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #22 on: Dec 07, 2005, 11:02:42 PM »
woodwiz: "I've got one of those, but it's so old it rings at 432 Hz. "

One word for you, young feller: Brasso.

Then check it with one of them newfangled quartz jobbies.

From what I can tell, 432 herz was generally accepted "secular" concert pitch from 1880 to 1885, and I'm given to understand that it is still the nationally accepted concert pitch in Italy.

I don't think Brasso's gonna do the trick. A $10.00 Quartz jobby does fine.

Offline rcc

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #23 on: Dec 07, 2005, 11:57:48 PM »
I have an OT-12 and I really like it.

Pythagorean, Just, and Equal temperaments are different for most intervals so if you're going to learn intonation with the help of an electronic tuner, a chromatic tuner will teach you to only be approximately in tune.  More importantly, if you have a tuner that understands all the temperaments, it will make it easier for you to learn to hear the differences.

The OT-12 is also great for those of us who like to cross-tune as the tuner understands keys as well as temperaments.  So if I'm tuning the fiddle AEAE which essentially means I've tuned it to the key of A, I can put the OT-12 into the key of A and then tune the strings very accurately indeed.  You can really tell the difference on a cross-tuned fiddle if one string is even a few cents off so it's nice to have a tuner that will actually help you there.  Ears are nice but as you say, it's tough to tune with your ears when it's noisy.

- Ray

Offline B natural

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #24 on: Dec 08, 2005, 11:39:47 AM »
I got one of these digital tuner thingies and only used it a couple of times. I'm so used to my old tuning fork, dunted on a hard surface then stuck between my front teeth, which is far quicker for tuning up. It pays to learn how to tune, by ear, the other strings to the A string - much faster in the end. I suppose that's the old fashioned way to do it but sometimes old fashioned = best. No flat batteries to worry about with a tuning fork either  ;)
Rob.

Offline Steve_W

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #25 on: Dec 08, 2005, 09:01:26 PM »
Well, I carry a tuning fork too but if you're playing with a piano or other non-adjustable instrument that's not calibrated to A440, that won't help you much!  At the last dance my band played I was sure that I was in tune with the piano but later listening to the minidisc recording I'd made, I realized I was slightly out for a good part of the dance.  Like Fiddlegirl I've decided I need a tuning aid on stage so am now in the market for a calibratable pitch-matching tuner like the ones discussed earlier. 

The OT-12 sounds like a great tuner to me but for my purposes it's probably overkill.  I agree that if I wanted a tuner for intonation work this is the one I'd choose.  I realized that since I usually play with pianos or other equally-tempered instruments, I probably actually want a tuner with equal temperament anyway, so can likely get by with the CA-30. -Steve

Offline fiddlegirlLA

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #26 on: Dec 08, 2005, 11:17:58 PM »
I realized that since I usually play with pianos or other equally-tempered instruments, I probably actually want a tuner with equal temperament anyway, so can likely get by with the CA-30. -Steve

You know, that is a good point. I wonder if it's better to have your instrument in tune with itself or to be in tune with the other equally-tempered instruments you're playing with?? Maybe it depends on the style of music you're playing. If you're playing a lot of double-stops, you probably want to make sure you're in tune with yourself...anyone else out there dealt with this?

Andrea

Offline Happy Camper

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #27 on: Dec 09, 2005, 12:54:23 AM »

I have used the Intellitouch tuner for several years on my fiddles and mandolins and think it is great.  No worry of noise in the area since it works simply off vibration for the tuning.  Mine is not the Bare Bones, it lights up so you can see the face in bad lighting which has been a plus many times.

A lot of people I see, use it also for their guitars, but I never did particularly like it for the guitar, may just not have tried it enough, but, for mando or fiddle, I sure like it.

I am sure the others mentioned work quite well also.

Offline wildberry

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #28 on: Dec 09, 2005, 05:05:13 AM »
You know, that is a good point. I wonder if it's better to have your instrument in tune with itself or to be in tune with the other equally-tempered instruments you're playing with?? Maybe it depends on the style of music you're playing. If you're playing a lot of double-stops, you probably want to make sure you're in tune with yourself...anyone else out there dealt with this?

Andrea
Hi Andrea,
     What I discovered is that equally-tempered tuning is not dead on for strings like violin that normally are tuned in perfect fifths....also, I needed a good, accurate tuner for a noisy stage to be plugged in directly from my electric violins and tuned silently.  So I went with the Peterson VS-II Virtual Strobe Tuner....It's digital, has a LARGE display and is programmable while extremely easy to use on stage.  I can now tune at A-440 with all the strings in perfect fifths.  It's so awesome to go from the silent tuning to perfect double stops in a LOUD environment!  But it's pricey though....but at $200,  that is still much cheaper than a very expensive moment destroyed by a less than perfectly tuned electric violin!!!!....Pythagorean tuning is what it's called. 
      With cross tuning, not sure how that works with this tuner, but it's programmable for MANY different tunings or temperaments...And Peterson Strobe tuners have been seen on most pro stages for many years now.

Offline fiddlegirlLA

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #29 on: Dec 09, 2005, 07:14:33 AM »
cool, thanks for the feedback, all. I think I'll go check out ebay!
Andrea

Offline Steve_W

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #30 on: Dec 09, 2005, 09:47:23 PM »
Hi Andrea,
     What I discovered is that equally-tempered tuning is not dead on for strings like violin that normally are tuned in perfect fifths....also, I needed a good, accurate tuner for a noisy stage to be plugged in directly from my electric violins and tuned silently.  So I went with the Peterson VS-II Virtual Strobe Tuner....It's digital, has a LARGE display and is programmable while extremely easy to use on stage.  I can now tune at A-440 with all the strings in perfect fifths.  It's so awesome to go from the silent tuning to perfect double stops in a LOUD environment!

The question remains, when you tune to just intonation, can you hear a difference in the open strings when playing with an equally-tempered instrument? -Steve

Offline apollonike

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #31 on: Dec 09, 2005, 11:34:08 PM »
Yes.

Offline Nox

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #32 on: Dec 16, 2005, 01:59:06 AM »
Well, the IntelliTouch tuner has been great for my violin...no regrets whatsoever, use it all the time...but I'm still looking for a regular one that will tell me what note I'm playing when I'm up in the E string strasiphere...

...to that end I went to a local music stop that closing down...to see what they had on sale...

...well, no tuners...all sold out...but!

I came home with a great set of Bongo drums and a Bongo drum stand (along with a couple of other items - hey! 25-50 % off)!!!

Now I just have to figure out what to do with the Bongo drums...


Offline fiddlegirlLA

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #33 on: Dec 21, 2005, 08:03:30 PM »
Now I just have to figure out what to do with the Bongo drums...


Are your bongos tuned in equal-temperment? LOL.

I've decided not to go with equal temperment for the band I'm currently in because I like the slightly off, raw sound I get when I'm in just tuning and everyone else is in equally-tempered tuning. Actually, it has a lot to do with the fact that we have a cello in the band, too, and she tunes in just tuning, so it's better if we're in tune with each other. That may change at some point or in a different band, but for now I like to think of myself as tuned correctly and everyone else in the band as out of tune. LOL. 

Offline elbohead

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #34 on: Dec 24, 2005, 03:21:12 AM »
I have the Intellitouch tuner. Everyone at the jam sessions I attend had one so I bought one. Lots of players leave them on their instruments while playing, clamped to the headstock of a guitar, mandolin or banjo. This won't work with a fiddle due to the taper of the scroll. Other than that, I like it just fine. A friend did have one hint that has helped. Ball up your cleaning cloth and toss it in your case. With the tuner clamped in place, rest the scroll gently against the cloth. It seems to absorb some of the vibration, and makes the tuner "lock in" better.

Offline marktheharp

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #35 on: Jan 01, 2006, 07:59:40 PM »
We have managed to play with a number of tuners in our shop: my favourite so far for sheer value (ie great features for very little money) is the EMO tuner - an example at : http://www.danceofdelight.co.uk/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=47&products_id=170

The reason I like this particular one is that it can cope with a very wide range of "A" pitch references (410-450), and it's the only one we carry which will give you an indication of which octave you're on (plus it has a metronome with a volume control, and can also "sound" any pitch). It comes with a contact mic which you can attach to your instrument.

As a harp player, I've also seen some really good contact tuners (similar to the Intellitouch ones) which harpists have built into their instruments so they can tune without having to grovel around in a bag and attach tuners / leads (for example, you can permanently build in to the front pillar of the harp in a position that you can see, but the audience can't - OK with a harp!).

PS the Intellitouch "barebones" (PT-2) is a very good model. The more expensive Intellitouch model, the PT-1, is different in that, apart from a backlight, it can be programmed to base its reference on any note from any instrument, so you can tune your instrument to that piano that can't (as) easily be tuned as your fiddle - and of course, it can cope with baroque pitches.

Finally, if you have an older digital tuner (for example, I have a couple of Korgs which I inherited when I bought two of my harps) you will find the newer tuners respond more quickly than older designs. It seems the software built into these things is better nowadays at very quick pitch recognition.

Offline Joyful noise

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Re: Electronic Tuners
« Reply #36 on: Jan 01, 2006, 08:43:55 PM »
I agree with B natural....
at most, a tuning fork (A) and your ears...   
Admit it is a problem when thinking about equal/unequal temerapment...    :laugh:
When i am with the authentic baroque lot, I tune to the oboe and pray hard about the rest!   ;)

 




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